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Welcome To Roj Bash Kurdistan 

North Kurdistan or "United Armenia"

A place for discussion and exchanging ideas about Kurdistan issues here, also a place for sharing article & views and analysis about Kurdistan .

what is Van?

Turkish city.
0
No votes
Kurdish city.
13
81%
Armenian city.
2
13%
All of them
1
6%
 
Total votes : 16

North Kurdistan or "United Armenia"

PostAuthor: Sero » Sun Oct 02, 2005 3:08 pm

hey,

for those who know about the treaty of sèvres, they know that it entailed the creation of an independant kurdistan and also allocated some kurdish lands to armenia. here is a map ( very very bad map but only one I can find so far ) :

http://www.hri.org/docs/sevres/map3.html

and another not much better :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Treaty_Of_Sevres.gif

still u can clearly see, the kurdish land going through antep also urfa I think, there's amed ( diyarbakir ), but clearly u can see van, bitlis and all the eastern kurdish lands of north kurdistan are in armenia ( and mardin is in syria ).

the dashnak party of armenia, I think some kind of armenian nationalist party, and some other armenian organizations claim that they want to get back "United Armenia" which means all these lands that are in Armenia in that map.

so I wondered several things, first I always thought there was a kurdish majority in all these lands all the time, so logically these lands even before the genocide should have been in Kurdistan.

2nd what do u think of these unrealistic claims they're making... since Van and all these cities is 100% kurdish now ( even if the whole armenian diaspora came back which I doubt, it would still be kurdish... ).

and 3rd should we claim the map of treaty of sèvres as a basis for our request, as many do, since it cuts us off a main part of our land?

thanks.

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North Kurdistan or "United Armenia"

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PostAuthor: Diri » Sun Oct 02, 2005 3:21 pm

Welcome to this forum Sero. Where are you from? Sêro? :) :P


This topic that you have opened was opened some time before... There is a map of the Treaty of Sèvres there:


http://northerniraq.info/forums/viewtopic.php?t=146
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PostAuthor: Cems Bond » Sun Oct 02, 2005 3:43 pm

hey :)

dats me again I just thought this name is more funny so I made a new account. lol.

neways thanks for welcome no I'm not from sêro... I didn't even know this city :/ where is it

thanks for the map also, it's better. but it doesn't talk about the dashnak in the messages. does anybody know of this party? they seem a little extreme, they want to get all "their" lands back and since I cannot imagine that they want a kurdish-majority armenia, I can only assume that they want to genocide / deport all the kurds living there. yet they're in the coalition in power in armenia.

I think dashnak formal name is ARF.

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PostAuthor: Diri » Sun Oct 02, 2005 4:01 pm

Cems Bond wrote:hey :)

dats me again I just thought this name is more funny so I made a new account. lol.

neways thanks for welcome no I'm not from sêro... I didn't even know this city :/ where is it

thanks for the map also, it's better. but it doesn't talk about the dashnak in the messages. does anybody know of this party? they seem a little extreme, they want to get all "their" lands back and since I cannot imagine that they want a kurdish-majority armenia, I can only assume that they want to genocide / deport all the kurds living there. yet they're in the coalition in power in armenia.


I think dashnak formal name is ARF.



You are welcome-----> Sêro is where I am from... It is in northern part of East Kurdistan - just west of Ûrmiye city...

That map is good, yes... And yes - I know who the Dashnaks are... They are branded as terrorist by Turkey and extreme right in Armenia - they want to incorporate half of Northern Kurdistan into Greater Armenia...

This is of course rediculus - since Kurds have always been a clear majority in the area... Well at least for the last 1000 years... Anyway - I have posted an Ethnicity map here on the KURDISTAN thread - look for it - it says "European Races" - or something like that... And there you can CLEARLY see that Kurds and Armenians inhabit the same lands - some places Kurds are majority and some places Armenians are... But the point is that now there is hardly any Armenians left there... :roll:
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PostAuthor: Cems Bond » Sun Oct 02, 2005 4:35 pm

yeah that's what I thought too.

but then should we claim we deserve a land from the treaty of sèvres, since this treaty doesn't include the 3/4 of our land...? there's not even urfa and malatya and van in it :/

I think we shouldn't use this treaty as a basis because even if it's better than what we have now we still got kinda screwed in that treaty :/

btw who voted for "all of them"? and why?

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PostAuthor: Vladimir » Sun Oct 02, 2005 7:10 pm

I guess the Breton TOmjez. The city is Kurdish/Armenian.
The suppression of ethnic cultures and minority religious groups in attempting to forge a modern nation were not unique to Turkey but occurred in very similar ways in its European neighbours - Bruinessen.

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PostAuthor: tomjez » Mon Oct 03, 2005 8:04 am

Hey I just came, I voted kurdish :lol:
http://istanbuldakitom.blogspot.com/

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PostAuthor: Piling » Mon Oct 03, 2005 12:37 pm

For the present I vote Kurdish too. Before the genocide, it was Kurdish-Armenian, or Armenian Kurdish but there were Turks too.
In La Turquie d'Asie, the geographer Cuinet gave an estimation of the population the wilayet of Van not only the city then, all the district) at the end of the XIXth century. But at this time, the wilayet included the 2 sanjak of Van and Hakkari :

- 30,000 Turks.
- 210,000 Kurds.
- 79,000 Armenians.
- 92,000 Assyrians-Nestorians.

Around 1917, the population of the city was estimated to :

- 25,000 Armenians.
- 10,000 Muslims (indiferently Kurds or Turks).

So we could see that the city was probably more Armenian than Kurds, but Kurds were the more numerous in the region.

Now after the war and all that villages burned and displaced populations, Van is becoming the hugest Kurdish metropolis in Turkey, may be more important in demography than Diyarbakir.
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PostAuthor: ellinas » Tue Oct 04, 2005 3:01 pm

about this map. just listen me.

This city as ancient is Kurdish city then turkeys come and kill people to take the land. after wars Armenians take land from turks. thats how come this map. this map who i see is not saw what the areas and cities must be but saw what happen to area an excacly year or a period. We must be proud that Van is under Armenians for long period. Sure as deafault this city is Kurdish. but when something is lost, the only way to take it back is the war.so if i have to choose between turks and armenians who under that area land, i choose the armenians cuz armenians will leave free the people to do everything they want and named like region kurdistan or something. but sure if a country have a land... they can't say hey friend ok take this land for you. cuz if they say that they will have lot of political problems. but the hope is never die. id better we not talk what this city is, cuz right now is kurdish under turkish. that we must talk about is what must this city to be. and i answer Kurdish :-). hope will come this day... and don't forget guys in the future i want to travel in Kurdistan :-) i hope to am welcome.

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PostAuthor: tomjez » Wed Oct 05, 2005 3:32 pm

Well actually when it was armenian it was armenian under ottoman (or turkish) from X century to 1915...Before it was Byzantine Empire, before roman empire...
http://istanbuldakitom.blogspot.com/

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