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If Parliament asks Erdogan he will approve death penalty

A place to talk about domestic politics in Middle East (Iran, Iraq , Turkey, Syria) Also includes topics about Assyrian, Armenian, Chaldean .

If Parliament asks Erdogan he will approve death penalty

PostAuthor: Anthea » Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:16 am

Countdown to disaster 10 days before Erdogan become GOD

phpBB [video]


Direct link to Video:
https://youtu.be/aesck2Z1DFg

When Erdogan becomes GOD on 16 April - he will have the same powers as Grand Ayatollah Seyyed Ali Khamenei, the Supreme Leader of the Islamic Republic of Iran

Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, the Supreme Leader of the Islamic Republic of Turkey :-s :ymsick: X(

Supreme Leader Erdogan will be able to do exactly what he wants with the Kurds :shock:

Erdogan loves Kurds even less than Khamenei does - if Kurds do not demand independence from Turkey, in a few years time there will NOT be any Kurds left in Turkey :((
Last edited by Anthea on Tue Apr 18, 2017 9:32 am, edited 7 times in total.
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If Parliament asks Erdogan he will approve death penalty

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Re: Countdown to disaster 5 days before Erdogan becomes GOD

PostAuthor: Anthea » Tue Apr 11, 2017 7:50 pm

I cannot understand why the entire world is so anti-Assad (a Shia Muslim) when Erdogan (a Sunni Muslim) is far more dangerous and about to obtain almost God-like powers X(

    Erdogan is currently far more powerful than Assad has ever been

    After Erdogan wins the referendum (little doubt he will win) his power inside Turkey will be limitless and he will NOT be answerable to anyone anywhere

    Erdogan will continue in his quest of change Turkey from being a Secular State, into an Islamic State

    Islamic State!

    I seem to have heard that phrase somewhere before 8-|

    Turkey has killed, is still killing and will continue to kill more Kurds than Syria

    Turkey is a member of NATO :shock:

    Turkey has nuclear weapons :ymsick:
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Re: Forget Assad in 3 days Erdogan as GOD will be far worse

PostAuthor: Anthea » Thu Apr 13, 2017 11:42 am

Under Erdogan:

Turkey is taking control of Kurdish cities and towns

Turkey installs frequent curfews

Turkish soldiers and police raid Kurdish homes, smashing and destroying property

Turkey frequently arrests Kurdish youths

Turkey has arrested many legally elected Kurdish MPs and Mayors

Turkey is replacing Kurdish Mayors with Turkish ones

Turkey is destroying many Kurdish areas and in some instances destroying entire villages

Turkey is

KILLING KURDS
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Re: Forget Assad in 3 days Erdogan as GOD will be far worse

PostAuthor: Anthea » Thu Apr 13, 2017 11:56 am

Re Erdogan's PRETEND coup

For the first time since the foundation of the Turkish republic in 1923, the people had managed to stand up to the tanks. Over the decades, four coups had succeeded - Erdogan ensured a fifth did not.

Millions gathered in nightly rallies, chanting his name and singing his campaign song.

Erdogan went from almost losing control of his country to becoming untouchable.

But for Turkey's most powerful leader since its founding father, Mustafa Kemal Ataturk, it wasn't enough. After 11 years as prime minister, Erdogan had been elected president in 2014.

The post was traditionally largely ceremonial but Erdogan had other ideas.

The dominant figure in Turkish politics had long dreamed of enshrining his authority through constitutional change, turning Turkey from a parliamentary to a presidential republic, scrapping the post of prime minister and consolidating his hold on the country.

On 16 April the Turkish people will decide in a referendum whether to accept his grand reform.

The decision has become, in effect, a referendum on Erdogan and the Turkey he has moulded in his image - fiercely nationalist, Islamic, conservative and beset by problems.

This previously stable corner of the region has become consumed by terror attacks - once-rapid economic growth has stalled.

Dozens of journalists are in jail. Three million, mostly Syrian, refugees have poured into the country.

Tens of thousands of people have been arrested or dismissed following the failed (pretend) coup. The country's hope of EU membership is evaporating. And Turkey is arguably more politically polarised than ever.

But at the same time, Turkey has gone from a financial basket-case at the turn of the century into one of the world's top 20 economies.

The middle-class has hugely expanded. Millions of impoverished Turks have been economically emboldened under Erdogan's leadership.

Schools, hospitals, roads and giant infrastructure projects have transformed daily life. Pious Turks, who long felt excluded by an old secular elite, have been empowered. And Turkey has freed itself from the grip of a once omnipotent military.

And now, the country will vote on its future. (God help the Kurds)

Referendum proposals:

Prime minster role scrapped, new vice president role created

President becomes head of government as well as state, and can retain political party ties

President given sweeping powers, with ability to enact laws by decree and dismiss parliament

Parliament no longer able to scrutinise ministers

Parliament given limited powers to investigate or impeach president
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Re: Forget Assad in 3 days Erdogan as GOD will be far worse

PostAuthor: Anthea » Sat Apr 15, 2017 12:45 am

Turkey votes on constitutional changes in Sunday's referendum

Following a two-month-long constitutional amendment campaign where both "yes" and "no" voters elucidated their positions in a rather festival-like display of democracy, the people now have the last say regarding the Constitution on Sunday.

The political parties' constitutional amendment campaigns started on Feb. 10 when President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan signed the constitutional amendment package, steering Turkey to a referendum. The political parties have sought the support and favor of citizens through their trouble-free referendum campaigns and via colorful and highly enthusiastic campaign advertising on television channels and streets in Turkey. Prior to the referendum, 339 deputies approved the 18-article amendment package on Jan. 21, which was subsequently ratified by President Erdoğan on Feb 10.

The amendments would give executive power to the president and vice president, while merging the presidency and the prime ministry to establish a more "functional and effective system of governing that is set to clear the way for a separation between the executive, legislative and judicial branches," as politicians described it. The president would also be able to remain affiliated with a political party, while being criminally liable.

Furthermore, the proposed law lowers the age of candidacy for Parliament from 25 to 18 and increases the number of parliamentarians from 550 to 600 in accordance with the growing population. Changes will also be made to the Supreme Board of Judges and Prosecutors (HSYK): The number of HYSK members will decrease from 17 to 15, as military commissions and courts will be abolished.

Other amendments propose that general elections will be held every five years, instead of the current four years, with the presidential election taking place at the same time. The president could appoint presidential aides and ministers, and he also has the right to unseat them. In addition, the Cabinet will be abolished, but there will be ministers.

In the new system, the president would have executive power and authority within the limits of the law, while Parliament would have the power to discuss and change executive decrees and take the country to parliamentary and presidential elections, according to the "yes" campaign. Aside from changing to an executive presidency, other reforms allow the president to maintain a party affiliation. President Erdoğan, for example, has been dwelling on this change, in particular, at rallies.

Meanwhile, there are 55,319 222 eligible voters, with 1,269 282 of the voters 18 years of age. There are to be 167,140 ballot boxes throughout the country with 461 ballots placed in prisons. People can vote from 7 a.m – 4 p.m. on Sunday, April 16, in the provinces of Adıyaman, Ağrı, Artvin, Bingöl, Bitlis, Diyarbakır, Elazığ, Erzincan, Erzurum, Gaziantep, Giresun, Gümüşhane, Hakkari, Kars, Malatya, Kahramanmaraş, Mardin, Muş, Ordu, Rize, Siirt, Sivas, Trabzon, Tunceli, Şanlıurfa, Van, Bayburt, Batman, Şırnak, Ardahan, Iğdır and Kilis. In all other provinces, voting will take place from 8 a.m. – 5 p.m. All referendum campaigning must stop on Saturday at 6 p.m., according to the Supreme Election Board (YSK). Until that time, political parties as well as radio and television channels can conduct their campaigns in both Turkish and other languages.

Additionally, citizens living abroad cast votes at 120 polling stations in 57 countries March 27-April 9. The participation rate was 47.1 percent as 1,326 070 citizens voted abroad. As of April 9, 73,976 people voted at customs gates in Turkey, while ballot boxes at border points remain open until April 16. Including custom gates, as of the end of April 9, the number of votes cast abroad was 1,400,046 compared to 1,326,070 in the November 2015 general elections, a 14.3-percent increase.

Ballot boxes have been placed at customs offices at the following border points: Sarp, Kapıkule, Ipsala, Hamzabeyli, Dilucu and Dereköy; in the following airports: Şakirpaşa, Esenboğa, Antalya, Çardak, Eskişehir, Elazığ, Gaziantep, Hatay, Istanbul Atatürk, Istanbul Sabiha Gökçen, Adnan Menderes, Erkilet, Konya, Dalaman, Bodrum-Milas, Samsun, Trabzon and Zonguldak and in the port gates of Kuşadası, Ayvalık, Derince, Mersin, Taşucu, Marmaris and Samsun.

Minister of Interior Süleyman Soylu announced earlier this week that 251,788 police officers and 128,445 members of the gendarmerie would be on duty. He also said there are to be 51,148 security officers in 26 provinces and an additional 18,675 voluntary security officers. "In addition, we have planned an additional 6,000 Ground Forces personnel in case of necessity." In case of possible electricity cuts, Soylu said the Ministry of Energy and Natural Resources appointed 9,674 patrol officers, including gendarmeries and 8,000 police officers, to critical power distribution units. "Relevant units are to be on duty for 24 hours in case of a possible cyberattack," Soylu asserted. Political party buildings, government institutions and public places will be monitored via security cameras in case of possible threats.

https://www.dailysabah.com/elections/20 ... referendum
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Re: After Erdogan wins on Sunday will he execute Ocalan?

PostAuthor: Anthea » Sat Apr 15, 2017 1:04 am

Turkey has been happily slaughtering Kurds for the past 100 years and it does NOT show any signs of stopping - nor has it stopped destroying Kurdish towns and villages X(

Turkey stopped the death penalty because it wanted to join the EU, but as there is very little chance of that happening any time soon - if ever - Turkey may well reinstate the death penalty

Many Muslim countries have the death penalty

America still has the death penalty :ymsick:

If Turkey executed Ocalan - the Kurds would rise up - Erdogan would accuses them of being connected to ISIS and use his power to take more control of the Kurdish homeland X(
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Re: After Erdogan wins on Sunday will he execute Ocalan?

PostAuthor: Piling » Sat Apr 15, 2017 12:25 pm

It would be a bad try to execute Öcalan. A prisonner-hostage is a precious tool to manipulate the PKK and HDP's policy.
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Re: After Erdogan wins on Sunday will he execute Ocalan?

PostAuthor: Anthea » Sat Apr 15, 2017 10:58 pm

Piling wrote:It would be a bad try to execute Öcalan. A prisonner-hostage is a precious tool to manipulate the PKK and HDP's policy.


The manipulation has not been working very well since the PKK went to Syria - they have now developed a taste for for :D

Erdogan has arrested absolutely everyone who stands against him - all he has to do now is too execute Ocalan and when the Kurds revolt, Turkey will just use it as an excuse to annihilate some more of them X(

Turkey might even tell the west that the PKK are connected to ISIS and then they will all be doomed :shock:
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Re: Turkey's vote will be what Erdogan wants 60% YES

PostAuthor: Anthea » Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:11 pm

8 wanted suspects detained at polling stations
By Associated Press

The Latest on the referendum in Turkey, set to decide whether more power should be concentrated in the hands of the president (all times local):

4:50 p.m.

Turkey's state-run news agency says at least eight people wanted by authorities for their alleged links to outlawed groups have been detained at polling stations.

A woman waits at the entrance of a polling station in Ankara, Turkey, on Sunday, April 16, 2017. Polling stations for a historic referendum called by President Recep Tayyip Erdogan opened Sunday, when voters are set to decide on the future of their country: Whether to approve or reject reforms that would concentrate power in the hands of the president. (AP Photo/Burhan Ozbilici)

Anadolu Agency said the suspects were detained in the cities of Adana, Malatya and Trabzon on Sunday by police who were waiting at polling stations for them to cast their votes in Turkey's historic referendum on whether to expand the president's powers.

At least five the individuals were detained for alleged links to the Kurdistan Workers' Party, or PKK, according to Anadolu.

The three others were wanted for ties to a movement led by U.S.-based Muslim cleric Fethullah Gulen, which Turkey accuses of carrying out last summer's failed military coup.

___

4:10 p.m.

Polling stations in Turkey's 32 eastern provinces have closed for the country's historic referendum on whether to expand presidential powers.

Voting in the more populous western provinces will end an hour later at 5 p.m. local time (14:00 GMT).

If the "yes" vote wins, 18 constitutional amendments would transform Turkey's system of government from parliamentary to presidential, abolish the office of the prime minister and grant sweeping executive powers to the president.

___

3:50 p.m.

Turkey's state-run news agency says the death toll in a fight outside a polling station in the southeastern province of Diyarbakir has risen to three.

Anadolu news agency said a land feud may have been the reason for Sunday's deadly quarrel, while the private Dogan news agency reported it as caused by "differences in political opinion."

The fight took place outside a village school where voting is going on for Turkey's historic referendum on expanding the president's powers.

Anadolu said two people were detained and gendarmes took security precautions at the village.

___

3:40 p.m.

The leader of Turkey's main nationalist party has cast his vote for the referendum in Ankara.

The Nationalist Action Party's Devlet Bahceli, a supporter of the constitutional amendments proposed in the referendum, described the vote as "an important turning point in the lives of our people."

The party, the fourth largest in parliament, has backed Turkey's President Recep Tayyip Erdogan and the ruling Justice and Development Party in their push to change Turkey's parliamentary system into a presidential one.

___

1:30 p.m.

Observers from the 57-nation Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe are monitoring the voting process in the Turkish capital as the country headed to polling stations in a historic referendum.

Tana de Zulueta, the head of the OSCE observation mission, said the group has been in the country since March 17 "to assess the campaign including the media environment, the legal framework, the conduct of the campaign for its conformity with international standards to which Turkey is party."

She said observers visited polling stations in 12 locations Sunday to complete its referendum assessment mission.

President Recep Tayyip Erdogan sharply criticized OSCE on Friday, saying, "Who are you? First know your place. You cannot meddle in what happens."

The group is expected to hold a news conference Monday on their preliminary findings and conclusions regarding the referendum process.

___

1 p.m.

Turkey's state-run news agency says two people have died in a fight outside a polling station in the southeastern province of Diyarbakir.

Anadolu news agency said a quarrel between two families turned deadly Sunday in a village school's garden where people were casting their votes on Turkey's referendum.

Voters are deciding Sunday whether to approve or reject changes that greatly expand the president's powers.

The agency said the reasons for the fight were unknown. The private Dogan news agency reported it as caused by "differences in political opinion."

One person remains hospitalized, and two others have been detained in the incident.

___

12:20 p.m.

Kemal Kilicdaroglu, the leader of Turkey's main opposition party and campaigner for a "no" vote in the referendum on constitutional amendments, has cast his ballot in the capital Ankara.

"We are voting for Turkey's fate today," Kilicdaroglu said, adding: "we hope the results will be good and together we can have the opportunity to discuss Turkey's other fundamental problems."

Kilicdaroglu, who leads the Republican People's Party, has been a vocal critic of the proposed constitutional amendments, arguing that increased presidential powers would lead to "one-man rule" in Turkey.

More than 55 million people are registered to vote in Sunday's historic referendum.

___

12 p.m.

Turkey's President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has cast his ballot in Istanbul in a referendum he described as a "not an ordinary vote."

Speaking to reporters after voting, Erdogan said: "We have held referendums before. But this referendum is now about a new administrative system for the Republic of Turkey, it's a choice for change and transformation."

"We need to make a decision that is beyond the ordinary," he said, adding that he hopes the nation will make the "expected" decision.

"I believe in my nation's democratic common sense," he said.

Bodyguards with automatic weapons stood guard outside the polling station as the president and his wife Emine Erdogan cast their ballots. Two of their grandchildren accompanied the couple.

Scores gathered to greet the president and snap pictures outside the polling station.

___

11 a.m.

Turkey's Prime Minister Binali Yildirim has cast his vote in the western province of Izmir, saying the outcome of the referendum is for the nation to decide.

Speaking to reporters outside the polling station after casting his vote, he said: "Whatever the result is, we will hold it in high esteem. The decision of our nation is the most beautiful decision."

The crowd in the polling station chanted, "Turkey is proud of you."

Both Yildirim and President Recep Tayyip Erdogan have led the campaign for a "yes" vote in the months leading up to the referendum.

Voters are deciding on Sunday whether to approve constitutional amendments that would replace the parliamentary system with a presidential one, scrapping the office of the prime minister and handing its powers to the president.

___

10:20 a.m.

Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu has lambasted foreign countries for attempting to influence Turkey's historic referendum as he cast his vote in the southern province of Antalya.

Cavusoglu said some "from abroad" ''tried to tell the Turkish nation what to do. They took sides but today the decision belongs to our nation."

He did not specify who he was referring to, but tensions have been high between Turkey and some European countries, particularly Germany and the Netherlands. President Recep Tayyip Erdogan branded both countries Nazis for not allowing Turkish ministers to campaign for a "yes" vote there.

The Netherlands withdrew Cavusoglu's landing permission in March, barring him from addressing expatriate Turks there. Turkey said it would impose sanctions and halted high-level political discussions.

Polls opened Sunday in a crucial referendum on whether to increase presidential powers.

___

9:40 a.m.

People were already lined up at an Istanbul polling station before it opened for Turkey's historic referendum on whether to grant sweeping powers to the president's office.

"We are here early to say 'no' for our country, for our children and grandchildren," said retired tax officer Murtaza Ali Turgut. His wife Zeynep agreed, saying: "I was going to come sleep here last night to vote at first light."

Another "no" voter, Husnu Yahsi, said: "I don't want to get on a bus with no brake system. A one-man system is like that."

In another Istanbul neighborhood, a "yes" voter expressed full support of President Recep Tayyip Erdogan. "Yes, yes, yes. Our leader is the gift of God to us. We will always support him. He's governing so well," Mualla Sengul said.

___

7 a.m.

The first polling stations have opened in Turkey's historic referendum on reforms that would concentrate power in the hands of the nation's president.

The 18 constitutional changes would convert Turkey's system of government from parliamentary to presidential, and abolish the office of the prime minister.

President Recep Tayyip Erdogan, who called the referendum and has championed the "yes" campaign, says the proposed "Turkish style" presidential system will ensure the country no longer risks having weak governments. Opponents fear the change will lead to autocratic one-man rule, ensuring Erdogan, who has been accused of repressing rights and freedoms, could govern until 2029 with few checks and balances.

Polls in the east opened at 7 a.m. (0400 GMT), while those in the west are to open an hour later.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/ap/art ... urope.html
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Re: Erdogan claims 51.7% YES - CHP claims 52% NO

PostAuthor: Anthea » Sun Apr 16, 2017 6:11 pm

Turkish 'Yes' lead narrows to 51.7 percent in final stages of count
By Tuvan Gumrukcu and Humeyra Pamuk

ANKARA/ISTANBUL Votes for constitutional change to hand President Tayyip Erdogan sweeping powers held a narrow lead with almost all ballot boxes opened on Sunday, but Turkey's three largest cities and the mainly Kurdish southeast looked set to vote "No".

The "Yes" votes stood at 51.7 percent after 95 percent of ballots had been opened, state-run Anadolu news agency said, with the lead narrowing in the final stages of an increasingly tight count.

A "Yes" vote would replace Turkey's parliamentary democracy with an all-powerful presidency and may see Erdogan in office until at least 2029, in the most radical change to the country's political system in its modern history.

The outcome will also shape Turkey's strained relations with the European Union. The NATO member state has curbed the flow of migrants - mainly refugees from wars in Syria and Iraq - into the bloc but Erdogan says he may review the deal after the vote.

In Turkey's three biggest cities - Istanbul, Izmir and the capital Ankara - the "No" camp appeared set to prevail narrowly, according to Turkish television stations.

Speaking to reporters in Ankara, Deputy Prime Minister Veysi Kaynak said that the "Yes" camp had not won as many votes as expected, but was still ahead nationwide.

Earlier in the day a crowd chanted "Recep Tayyip Erdogan" and applauded as the president shook hands and greeted people after voting in a school near his home in Istanbul. His staff handed out toys for children in the crowd.

"God willing I believe our people will decide to open the path to much more rapid development," Erdogan said in the polling station after casting his vote.

"I believe in my people's democratic common sense."

The "Yes" percentage of the vote - which stood at 63 percent after around one quarter had been opened - eased as the count came further west towards Istanbul and the Aegean coast. Broadcaster Haberturk said turnout was 86 percent.

The opposition People's Republican Party (CHP) said a last-minute decision by the electoral board to accept unstamped ballots as valid votes put the vote in question.

"We will pursue a legal battle. If the irregularities are not fixed, there will be a serious legitimacy discussion," CHP deputy chairman Bulent Tezcan said.

DIVISIVE VOTE

The referendum has bitterly divided the nation. Erdogan and his supporters say the changes are needed to amend the current constitution, written by generals following a 1980 military coup, confront the security and political challenges Turkey faces, and avoid the fragile coalition governments of the past.

"This is our opportunity to take back control of our country," said self-employed Bayram Seker, 42, after voting "Yes" in Istanbul.

"I don't think one-man rule is such a scary thing. Turkey has been ruled in the past by one man," he said, referring to modern Turkey's founder Mustafa Kemal Ataturk.

Opponents say it is a step towards greater authoritarianism in a country where some 47,000 people have been jailed pending trial and 120,000 sacked or suspended from their jobs in a crackdown following a failed coup last July, drawing criticism from Turkey's Western allies and rights groups.

"I voted 'No' because I don't want this whole country and its legislative, executive and judiciary ruled by one man. This would not make Turkey stronger or better as they claim. This would weaken our democracy," said Hamit Yaz, 34, a ship's captain, after voting in Istanbul.

Relations between Turkey and Europe hit a low during the referendum campaign when EU countries, including Germany and the Netherlands, barred Turkish ministers from holding rallies in support of the changes. Erdogan called the moves "Nazi acts" and said Turkey could reconsider ties with the European Union after many years of seeking EU membership.

GUARD KILLED

Kurdish militants overnight killed a guard in an attack on a vehicle carrying a district official from Yildirim's ruling AK Party in southeast Turkey's Van province, security sources said.

They said Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK) militants staged the attack in Van's Muradiye district. A second of the AKP official's guards was wounded and 17 people were detained over the attack, they added.

In the southeastern Diyarbakir province, two people were killed and one wounded in a gunfight in a village schoolyard which was being used as a polling station, other security sources said. The cause of the clash was not immediately clear.

On Saturday, Erdogan held four rallies in Istanbul, urging supporters to turn out in large numbers and saying it "will be a turning point for Turkey's political history".

Erdogan and the AK Party enjoyed a disproportionate share of media coverage in the buildup to the vote, overshadowing the secular main opposition CHP and the pro-Kurdish Peoples' Democratic Party (HDP).

CHP leader Kemal Kilicdaroglu has accused Erdogan of seeking a "one-man regime", and said the proposed changes would put the country in danger.

Proponents of the reform argue that it would end the current "two-headed system" in which both the president and parliament are directly elected, a situation they argue could lead to deadlock. Until 2014, presidents were chosen by parliament.

The government says Turkey, faced with conflict to the south in Syria and Iraq, and a security threat from Islamic State and PKK militants, needs strong and clear leadership to combat terrorism.

The package of 18 amendments would abolish the office of prime minister and give the president the authority to draft the budget, declare a state of emergency and issue decrees overseeing ministries without parliamentary approval.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-turke ... ld+News%29
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Re: Erdogan claims 51.7% YES - CHP claims 52% NO

PostAuthor: Anthea » Sun Apr 16, 2017 6:21 pm

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Re: Erdogan claims 51.7% YES - CHP claims 52% NO

PostAuthor: Anthea » Sun Apr 16, 2017 7:33 pm

Erdogan claims 51.7% YES - CHP claims 52% NO

PM claims win as count continues

The Turkish prime minister has claimed victory in the referendum to grant President Recep Tayyip Erdogan new powers, based on unofficial results.

Binali Yildirim was speaking as the count neared completion. With about 99% of ballots counted, "Yes" was on about 51.3% and "No" on about 48.7%.

Erdogan supporters say replacing the parliamentary system with an executive presidency would modernise the country.

The two main opposition parties are challenging the results.

A "Yes" vote could also see Mr Erdogan remain in office until 2029 :ymsick:

Three people were shot dead near a polling station in the south-eastern province of Diyarbakir, reportedly during a dispute over how they were voting.

This could get ugly: Mark Lowen, BBC News, Ankara

Supporters are streaming into the governing AK party's headquarters here in Ankara, car horns and campaign songs blaring - they are convinced the "Yes" side has won and that President Erdogan now has a mandate for the biggest political reform in Turkey's modern history.

The president has claimed victory but the opposition disputes it, complaining of massive irregularities with the voting, suggesting the state news agency manipulated results and vowing to challenge them with the supreme election board.

Turkey has shown itself more polarised than ever tonight. And if the protests gather steam, this could get ugly.

Critics abroad fear Erdogan's reach

"The presidential system, according to unofficial results, has been confirmed with a 'Yes' vote," Prime Minister Yildirim told a cheering crowd from the balcony at AKP headquarters in Ankara.

"This is a decision made by the people. In our democracy's history, a new page has opened."

President Erdogan reportedly called Mr Yildirim earlier to congratulate him.

Elsewhere, Deputy Prime Minister Veysi Kaynak admitted the "Yes" vote had been lower than expected.

How significant are the changes?

They would represent the most sweeping programme of constitutional changes since Turkey became a republic almost a century ago.

The president would be given vastly enhanced powers to appoint cabinet ministers, issue decrees, choose senior judges and dissolve parliament.

The new system would scrap the role of prime minister and concentrate power in the hands of the president, placing all state bureaucracy under his control.

What is the case for 'Yes'?

Mr Erdogan says the changes are needed to address Turkey's security challenges nine months after an attempted coup, and to avoid the fragile coalition governments of the past.

"This public vote is [about] a new governing system in Turkey, a choice about change and transition," he said after casting his vote in Istanbul.

The new system, he argues, will resemble those in France and the US and will bring calm in a time of turmoil marked by a Kurdish insurgency, Islamist militancy and conflict in neighbouring Syria, which has led to a huge refugee influx.

The referendum, the BBC's Mark Lowen reports, is effectively one on Mr Erdogan and the Turkey he has moulded in his image: fiercely nationalist and conservative.

And what about for 'No'?

The Republican People's Party (CHP) has demanded a recount of 60% of the votes.

Critics of the proposed changes fear the move would make the president's position too powerful, arguing that it would amount to one-man rule, without the checks and balances of other presidential systems.

They say his ability to retain ties to a political party - Mr Erdogan could resume leadership of the AK Party - would end any chance of impartiality.

Kemal Kilicdaroglu, leader of the CHP, told a rally in Ankara a "Yes" vote would endanger the country.

"We will put 80 million people... on a bus with no brakes," he said.

"No" supporters have complained of intimidation during the referendum campaign and that Turkey's highly regulated media has given them little coverage.

What's the wider context?

Many Turks already fear growing authoritarianism in their country, where tens of thousands of people have been arrested, and at least 100,000 sacked or suspended from their jobs, since a coup attempt last July.

The campaign unfolded under a state of emergency imposed in the wake of the failed putsch.

Mr Erdogan assumed the presidency, meant to be a largely ceremonial position, in 2014 after more than a decade as prime minister.

This once stable corner of the region has in recent years been convulsed by terror attacks and millions of refugees, mostly from Syria, have arrived.

At the same time, the middle class has ballooned and infrastructure has been modernised. Under Mr Erdogan, religious Turks have been empowered.

Relations with the EU, meanwhile, have deteriorated. Mr Erdogan sparred bitterly with European governments who banned rallies by his ministers in their countries during the referendum campaign. He called the bans "Nazi acts".

In one of his final rallies, he said a strong "Yes" vote would "be a lesson to the West".

Turkey's dominant president

The ultranationalists who could sway Erdogan

What's in the new constitution?

The draft states that the next presidential and parliamentary elections will be held on 3 November 2019.

The president would have a five-year tenure, for a maximum of two terms.

    The president would be able to directly appoint top public officials, including ministers

    He would also be able to assign one or several vice-presidents

    The job of prime minister, currently held by Binali Yildirim, would be scrapped

    The president would have power to intervene in the judiciary, which Mr Erdogan has accused of being influenced by Fethullah Gulen, the Pennsylvania-based preacher he blames for the failed coup in July

    The president would decide whether or not impose a state of emergency

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-39612562
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Re: Erdogan claims 51.7% YES - CHP claims 52% NO

PostAuthor: Anthea » Mon Apr 17, 2017 2:59 am

Erdogan warns opposition not to question referendum result

Turkey's president Recep Tayyip Erdogan has won a historic referendum that will greatly expand the powers of his office, although opposition parties said they would challenge the results.

With nearly all ballots counted, the "yes" vote stood at 51.41%, while the "no" vote was 48.59%, according to the state-run Anadolu Agency.

The head of Turkey's electoral board confirmed the "yes" victory and said final results would be declared in 11-12 days.

Although the margin fell short of the sweeping victory Mr Erdogan had sought in the landmark referendum, it could nevertheless cement his hold on power in Turkey.

The result is expected to have a huge effect on the country's long-term political future and its international relations.

The 18 constitutional amendments that will come into effect after the next election, scheduled for 2019, will abolish the office of the prime minister and hand sweeping executive powers to the president.

Mr Erdogan, who first came to power in 2003 as prime minister, had argued a "Turkish-style" presidential system would bring stability and prosperity to the country.

Turkey was rocked by a failed coup last year that left more than 200 people dead, and has been hit by a series of devastating attacks by the Islamic State group and Kurdish militants.

In his first remarks from Istanbul after the vote count showed the amendments winning approval, Mr Erdogan struck a conciliatory tone, thanking all voters no matter how they cast their ballots and calling the referendum a "historic decision".

He said: "April 16 is the victory of all who said 'yes' or 'no,' of the whole 80 million, of the whole of Turkey."

But he quickly reverted to a more abrasive style when addressing thousands of flag-waving supporters in Istanbul.

"There are those who are belittling the result. They shouldn't try, it will be in vain," he said. "It's too late now."

Responding to chants from the crowd to reinstate the death penalty, Mr Erdogan said he would take up the issue with the country's political leaders, adding that the question could be put to another referendum.

He also took a dig at international critics. During the referendum campaign, Ankara's relations soured with some European countries, notably Germany and the Netherlands.

Mr Erdogan branded officials in the two nations as Nazis for not allowing his ministers to campaign for the expatriate vote there.

"We want other countries and organizations to show respect to the decision of our people. We expect countries that we accept as our allies to show more sensitivity to our fight against terrorism," he said.

Opponents had argued the constitutional changes would give too much power to a man who they say has shown increasingly autocratic tendencies.

Opposition parties complained of a number of irregularities in the voting, and were particularly incensed by an electoral board decision announced on Sunday afternoon to accept as valid ballots that did not bear the official stamp.

"The Supreme Electoral Board changed rules mid-game, after the ballot envelopes were opened, in a way contrary to laws," said Kemal Kilicdaroglu, head of the main opposition People's Republican Party.

Earlier, the party's vice chairman, Erdal Aksunger, said it would challenge between 37% and 60% of the ballot boxes and accused Anadolu's results of being inaccurate.

But electoral board head Sadi Guven defended the decision.

"There is no question of changing the rules in the middle of the game," he said.

A pro-Kurdish opposition party that also opposed the constitutional changes said it plans to object to two-thirds of the ballots.

Given the contested outcome, Fadi Hakura, Turkey specialist at the London-based think tank Chatham House, described Mr Erdogan's win as a "pyrrhic victory that comes at a huge political cost".

He said: "The result will depend on how far the opposition will take their claim of irregularity in the voting, and what the international reaction will be."

Initial reaction from abroad was cautious. Senior EU officials - EU Commission chief Jean-Claude Juncker, EU foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini and enlargement commissioner Johannes Hahn - said they "take note of the reported results" and were awaiting a report from international election observers.

The referendum campaign was highly divisive and heavily one-sided, with the "yes" side dominating the airwaves and billboards. Supporters of the "no" vote have complained of intimidation, including beatings, detentions and threats.

More than 55 million people were registered to vote, while another 1.3 million expatriates cast ballots abroad. The ballots themselves did not include the referendum question - it was assumed to be understood.

The changes will allow the president to appoint ministers, senior government officials and half the members of Turkey's highest judicial body, as well as to issue decrees and declare states of emergency.

They set a limit of two five-year terms for presidents and also allow the president to remain at the helm of a political party.

Opponents fear the changes will lead to autocratic one-man rule, ensuring that the 63-year-old Mr Erdogan, who has been accused of repressing rights and freedoms, could govern until 2029 with few checks and balances.

In Istanbul, hundreds of demonstrators opposed to the amendments marched in a central neighbourhood late on Sunday, clanging pots and pans and chanting: "This is just the beginning, the struggle will continue."

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/ ... 28564.html
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Re: Now Erdogan won Turks want to reinstate death penalty

PostAuthor: Piling » Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:53 am

A part of Turkish electors could say yes to capital punishment, hoping that many Kurdish activists (and at first Öcalan) would be eliminated in that way.

Where is Erdogan's interest to execute Öcalan ?

It could be a good way of pressure and threatening against PKK : if you are not quiet, then…

He could see Öcalan's death as a way to disoriented and destroyed PYD-PKK's policy : hoping that Apo's supporters could be demotivated by his successors, and more, expecting an internal fight among PKK leadership to take or to keep the power.

This tactic could have 1 advantage for Turkey : weakening the PYD-YPG forces in Syria and then avoiding the existence of a 2nd Kurdish region at its border.

It has also a danger : with Öcalan in Imrali, PKK's decision could be kept under control when Öcalan orders cease-fire. His death could start on a huge and anarchic reprisal in all the country. And perhaps a rising of terrorism among civilians, a tactic that until now, Kurdish forces were reluctant to adopt.

But if Erdogan wishes to reinforce his new power (after all, the YES is not so strong) he could see a civil war as a good way to gain authority against Turkish opposition.

In all cases, it is a dangerous and hazardous game.
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Re: Now Erdogan won Turks want to reinstate death penalty

PostAuthor: Anthea » Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:52 am

Piling wrote:A part of Turkish electors could say yes to capital punishment, hoping that many Kurdish activists (and at first Öcalan) would be eliminated in that way.

Where is Erdogan's interest to execute Öcalan ?

It could be a good way of pressure and threatening against PKK : if you are not quiet, then…

He could see Öcalan's death as a way to disoriented and destroyed PYD-PKK's policy : hoping that Apo's supporters could be demotivated by his successors, and more, expecting an internal fight among PKK leadership to take or to keep the power.

This tactic could have 1 advantage for Turkey : weakening the PYD-YPG forces in Syria and then avoiding the existence of a 2nd Kurdish region at its border.

It has also a danger : with Öcalan in Imrali, PKK's decision could be kept under control when Öcalan orders cease-fire. His death could start on a huge and anarchic reprisal in all the country. And perhaps a rising of terrorism among civilians, a tactic that until now, Kurdish forces were reluctant to adopt.

But if Erdogan wishes to reinforce his new power (after all, the YES is not so strong) he could see a civil war as a good way to gain authority against Turkish opposition.

In all cases, it is a dangerous and hazardous game.


The PKK is becoming very strong in Syria and I believe Erdogan is terrified that will lead to a strengthening of support for Kurdish autonomy within the Turkish Kurdish community

In recent months, Turkey has taken control of many Kurdish villages through a mixture of violence, replacement of Kurdish officials and the increase of military bases - Kurds will wake up - hopefully while they still have some control/leadership of their own (though this is diminishing daily)

Were Ocalan to be executed - remembering America have executed people who have been on death row for 30 years - it would:

    Increase his support among the Kurd hating Turks

    Cause an uprising within the Kurdish community/PKK

    Gain Turkey international support to rid itself of it's terrorists

In today's society, where more that half the world fears the expansion of ISIS, it is more than likely Turkey would win international support to eliminate the PKK :ymsick:
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