People want to remove Nelson's Column & Captain Cook statue

[Anthea]

Charlottesville: State of emergency over US far-right rally

Officials in Charlottesville in the US state of Virginia have declared a state of emergency ahead of a large march by white nationalists.

Thousands of people are expected to join the "Unite the Right" rally against plans to remove a statue of a pro-slavery US Civil War general.

Personally, I believe that as black people are allowed to have statues for famous black people, white people should be allowed to keep the statue of Gen Robert E Lee

Also, there has been a sharp rise in the number of supporters of the 'black lives matter' campaign, so it is only right (no pun intended) that white people can have a 'white lives matter campaign'

To me the only group I support in America is the group (Native Lives Matter)

But the most important group to support is KURDISH LIVES MATTER

Violent clashes erupted between far-right groups and counter-protesters who have also gathered in the city.

At least two people have been injured, police say.

Police have fired tear gas against demonstrators and said that arrests had been made after a declaration of unlawful assembly at Emancipation Park.

The state of emergency allows local authorities to request additional resources if needed, the police department said.

The far-right protesters, some waving Confederate flags, carrying shields and wearing helmets, are angry about the planned removal of a statue of Gen Robert E Lee from Charlottesville. Gen Lee commanded the Confederate forces in the US Civil War of 1861-65.

The New York Times reports that some of them were chanting "You will not replace us," and "Jew will not replace us."

Anti-racism organisations such as Black Lives Matter have also held marches.

Shiquan Rah, a 21-year-old demonstrator who had joined the counter-protest said about the far-right groups: "These people don't have a message, their message is hate and violence. This is a spiritual war we're in."

The BBC's Joel Gunter in Charlottesville says police have not yet interrupted clashes between the rival demonstrators, adding that it had been "extremely violent" so far.

Virginia Governor Terry McAuliffe urged calm tweeting: "The acts and rhetoric in #Charlottesville over past 24 hours are unacceptable [and] must stop. A right to speech is not a right to violence."

US First Lady Melania Trump also condemned the violence, saying on Twitter: "Our country encourages freedom of speech, but let's communicate [without] hate in our hearts. No good comes from violence."

Charlottesville mayor Mike Signer had earlier called the rally a "parade of hatred, bigotry, racism and intolerance".

On Friday, the white nationalists held lit torches - which some observers described as a reference to the Ku Klux Klan - and chanted "White lives matter" as they marched through the University of Virginia in the city.

Charlottesville is considered a liberal college town - and 86% of the county voted for Hillary Clinton in last year's presidential elections.

However, the town has become a focal point for white nationalists after the city council voted to remove a statue of Gen Lee.

Some observers also argue that US President Donald Trump's election to the White House re-energised the far right across the US.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-40912509

[Piling]

As a white supremacist killed intentionally a white women with his car, I am not sure that for them ALL white lives matter.

[Anthea]

It seems that white southerners in Charlottesville, protested many times at the intended removal of Gen Robert E Lee's statute

This was by far the largest protest and I imagine they went all out to stir up as much publicity as possible after all their previous attempts failed

I blame the local government for allowing an opposing march to take place at the same time

Here in the UK police try to keep opposing groups apart to prevent conflict

From what I gather, initially it was nothing to do with racism but about paying respect to a great leader - and Gen Lee was a brilliant tactician who deserves respect

The history of the southern states has been twisted - people tend to forget that black people in the northern states of America were also slaves and just because they gave up slavery first there is no need for history to show northerners as good people

It was at about this time that while southerners were concentrating on the cotton and farming industry, the northerners were invading NATIVE lands and slaughtering them by the millions

[Anthea]

When the very kind British Government put an end to slavery in British Guyana, they transplanted Indians (from India not Native Americans) to help fill the gape left by slaves being freed

Indians and former slaves worked side by side on plantations while receiving almost no money, just a basic subsistence

Both groups were beaten and actually treated worse than they were when they were slaves, because neither group were of any monetary value

Many former slaves in the Southern American states were also treated badly by the north and upon liberation the lucky ones were often those who continued to work on their former master's property

Many years ago, I had the privilege of working with an Indian gentleman who was trying to get compensation for the descendants of those Indians who were unwillingly transported to British Guyana

[Piling]

The legacy of Secession War and the Lost Cause of the Confederacy is something so sensitive and irrational in the South that it might have been more prudent to let the statue untouched. But it is an American debate.

Some years ago, a movement of Black activists tried in France to attack any commemoration of Napoleon, because he restored slavery which has been cancelled by the 1st Republic. But the discuss was not so infuriating, most of French don't care of Napoleon while abroad he is one of the most famous historical figure.

[Anthea]

Confederate statue pulled down in North Carolina

A monument to pro-slavery forces is destroyed, in the wake of clashes in Charlottesville.

No arrests have been reported in connection with the incident in Durham, North Carolina.

Now it will become even more interesting and if someone pulls down, damages or defaces a black hero, America will have a civil war

Especially as the United States are not so united any more and America faces the largest drug problem ever - the government is on the verge on calling it a national emergency

It would appear that the use of drugs, both illegal and prescribed, increased exponentially under the Obama government meaning:

The United States has now a fast growing drug problem

A middle class popping pills

A stoned loony left

An extremely serious drug problem within the black community, with gun violence is on the increase in cities

The only 2 groups not high on drugs are the Right Wing and the Black Muslims

[Piling]

What happens in Durham is dangerous, because it could escalate to furious and violent street fights.

In France, our police would have forbidden the first demonstration in Charlottesville and put in jail the Durham vandals. Our State is touchy concerning public troubles and goods

So all that packs of white and black in the same 'panier à salade' (as we call the fourgon police).

[Anthea]

Left-wing militants on rise in Charlottesville and rest of of America

The violence and murder of a protester in Charlottesville, Virginia, over the weekend has been attributed to far-right elements that descended on the city to demonstrate against the proposed removal of a statue of Confederate war hero Robert E Lee

President Donald Trump drew widespread criticism on Saturday when he said that there was violence on "many sides" in Charlottesville and initially neglected to explicitly censure the white supremacists who organised the rally.

On Monday, he bowed to pressure to castigate the KKK, white supremacists and neo-nazis.

But many conservatives say blame should be shared by Antifa, a loosely affiliated group of far-left protesters.

Critics argue the media tends to excuse violence by Antifa militants just because they are fighting white supremacists and their odious ideology.

The social causes of Antifa (short for anti-fascist or Anti-Fascist action) are easily identifiable as left-leaning.

Most members oppose all forms of racism and sexism, and strongly oppose what they see as the nationalist, anti-immigration and anti-Muslim policies that Mr Trump has enacted.

However, as their name indicates, Antifa focuses more on fighting far-right ideology than encouraging pro-left policy.

Unlike the mainstream left, they do not seek to gain power through traditional channels - winning elections and passing bills into law.

Antifa is anti-government and anti-capitalist, and their methodologies are often perceived as more closely aligned with anarchists than the mainstream left.

Antifa does not shy away from militant protest methods, including the destruction of property and sometimes physical violence.

They were present at the 2017 Berkeley protests of far-right speaker Milo Yiannopoulos and at violent protests against Donald Trump's inauguration; they were also present at Charlottesville.

Antifa's roots go back almost as far as Nazis

Much like the far-right, Antifa members around the world comprise a patchwork of groups, though the most active appear to be based in the US, the UK (under the name Anti-Fascist Action) and Germany (Antifaschistische Aktion).

The German movement was founded in 1932 to provide a militant far-left group to counter the fast-rising Nazi party.

They were disbanded in 1933 after Hitler took control of parliament and resurrected in the 1980s as a response to neo-Nazism after the fall of the Berlin Wall.

President Trump's election seems to have been something of a touchstone for the Antifa movement, which has links with the Black Lives Matter (BLM) movement and various anarchist groups.

According to James Anderson, one of a group of people who run the popular anti-fascist and anarchist news site, It's Going Down, interest has spiked since Mr Trump's election.

The It's Going Down website, which received around 300 hits daily in 2015, now garners between 10-20,000 hits a day.

Since the events in Charlottesville on Saturday, the It's Going Down Twitter handle has gained 2,000 new followers.

While interest may have spiked since Mr Trump's election, it is all but impossible to quantify how many people are active members of Antifa.

Much like the far-right, chapters of Antifa are loosely connected and highly secretive, and organise mostly on message boards such as Reddit and over social networks like Twitter and Facebook.
Calls to label Antifa a terror organisation

Antifa has become a popular topic for right-leaning websites and among conservative pundits.

"Antifa and the white supremacists are two sides of a common coin. The people dead in Charlottesville died because of one neo-Nazi, but there were dozen [sic] of people left bleeding in the streets because of Antifa".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-40930831

[Anthea]

Trump said that if statues of people like Robert E. Lee, Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson, P.G.T. Beauregard and others are being taken down because they are offensive, who's next?

Carlson echoed Trump's concern that the left's disdain for slave-holding American icons trumps their importance in the country's history.

"Slavery is evil," Carlson said. "But, until 150 years ago... slavery was the rule rather than the exception."

He noted that George Washington, George Mason, Thomas Jefferson, and 41 of 56 Declaration signers held slaves.

"None of this is a defense of the atrocity of human bondage," he said, "But, if these men were simply racist villains... then the society they created was as evil as they were."

He called Jefferson the greatest American political thinker, and in contrast noted how CNN's Ashleigh Banfield once called for the Jefferson Memorial to be taken apart.

Carlson said that in denouncing and tearing down these monuments, the left is objecting to the First Amendment right to free speech.

He said leftist "radicals" want to "tear down" the rights of the individual in this way.

Is that the country you want to live in? If it's not, now's the time to speak up

http://insider.foxnews.com/2017/08/15/t ... ls-go-next

[Anthea]

Trump defends 'beautiful' Civil War statues
(and rightly so as many are truly works of art)

US President Donald Trump has denounced the removal of "beautiful" Confederate statues amid a heated national debate about US race relations.

"Sad to see the history and culture of our great country being ripped apart with the removal of our beautiful statues and monuments," he tweeted.

"You can't change history, but you can learn from it," he continued.

Mr Trump drew outrage by defending organisers of a white supremacist rally that left a woman dead and dozens hurt.

The rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, supported by neo-Nazis and white supremacists, was in protest of the removal of a statue of Robert E Lee, a general who had fought for the pro-slavery Confederacy during the US Civil War.

The first protests (there have been several) and the latest protest in Charlottesville, contained a great many protesters who were not white supremacists but normal Southerners who view the statue as a monument to their ancestors who fought in that terrible war

Personally, I feel it is hypocritical to condemn statues of Confederate war heroes when the Northern States of America and it's political leaders also used to support slavery

It puts me in mind of vegans who have eaten meat all their lives, then one day decide to become a vegan and go around telling other people that they should not eat meat

Also, I very much doubt that anyone in the north declined the wearing of cotton clothing or the use of cotton bedclothes and towels, due to the fact the cotton was grown with the use of slavery - the Northern soldiers would have been wearing such clothing during the fighting

From my knowledge of history, I am aware the Northern soldiers also raped and slaughtered large numbers of both white and black ladies in the south - liberated corpses

The unlicensed opposition protest should never have been allowed to take place

The destruction of other peoples' statues, monuments and shrines just because one does not share that particular ideology is wrong - think about it

[Anthea]

Boston march against right-wing rally draws thousands

Tens of thousands of anti-racism protesters have converged on a "Free Speech Rally" in the US city of Boston that featured right-wing speakers.

The rally on Boston Common, which attracted only a small crowd, disbanded early and the participants were escorted out by police.

Organisers had said they would not give a platform to racism or bigotry

Speaking ahead of the competing demonstrations, the city police commissioner said he had never seen so many people "almost looking for confrontation".

I FIRMLY BELIEVE IN FREE SPEECH

One of my dear friends spent many years at Hyde Park Corner (at one time the UK's main platform for free speech) trying to convince people that we should all work together - I had the privilege of working with him on 2 of his multi-cultural projects

Now we have POLITICAL CORRECTNESS

I hate political correctness

In UK social housing, if a member of an ethnic community wants to live where there are other from their community they are allowed to do so

If a member of the white indigenous population wants to live in a white area they are called racist

In Croydon, where I lived and worked for many years, we now have WHITE FLIGHT

Not just indigenous white people but Europeans as well stay clear of Croydon

Nobody ever dares to say the truth about anything concerning other ethnic groups

The main problems is that unless people face up to the difficulties and talk about them they will never be able to solve them

[Anthea]

Should Washington and Jefferson monuments come down?



President Donald Trump's argument that the removal of Confederate statues is a slippery slope to changing history has recharged the perennial debate about America's tormented racial legacy.

"So this week it's Robert E Lee," he said on Tuesday of the rebel general's monument that was a flashpoint for last Saturday's violent rally in Virginia.

"I wonder, is it George Washington next week?" he asked journalists at Trump Tower. "And is it Thomas Jefferson the week after?"

As President Trump pointed out, George Washington was a slaveholder.

So might the stone obelisk dedicated to the father of the nation, looming over the heart of his eponymous capital city, be the next battleground in the US culture wars?

Or even Mount Rushmore?

Washington conceded the system of human bondage that underpinned the economy of 18th Century Virginia was a "wicked, cruel and unnatural trade".

He was the only founding father and commander-in-chief to liberate his slaves - he owned more than 300 - when he died.

But as Ron Chernow's magisterial biography Washington: A Life makes clear, while he lived, the nation's first president extracted his pound of flesh from those whom he preferred to call his "servants", or "family".

Washington saw himself as a benevolent master, but he did not tolerate suspected shirkers on his farm, even when they were pregnant, elderly or crippled.

He once scolded a slave who pleaded that he could not work because his arm was in a sling.

As Chernow writes, Washington picked up a rake and demonstrated how to use it with one arm.

"If you use your hand to eat," he said, "why can't you use it to work?"

He was not averse to shipping refractory slaves to the West Indies, such as one man named Waggoner Jack, where the tropical climate and relentless toil in sugarcane brakes tended to abbreviate life expectancy.

"There are few Negroes who will work unless there be a constant eye on them," Washington advised one overseer, warning of their "idleness and deceit" unless treated firmly.

Washington, Chernow notes, wholly approved in 1793 when one of his estate managers, Anthony Whitting, whipped a slave named Charlotte.

Martha, the president's wife, had deemed her to be "indolent".

"Your treatment of Charlotte was very proper," Washington wrote, "and if she or any other of the servants will not do their duty by fair means, or are impertinent, correction (as the only alternative) must be administered."

Washington badgered Whitting to keep another slave named Gunner hard at work to "continue throwing up brick earth". Gunner was 83 years old.

With his Mount Vernon plantation creaking under financial pressure owing to his long absences serving the country, Washington would fire off angry letters to his overseers insisting on greater crop productivity.

Given these reprimands it is perhaps hardly surprising that another of his estate managers, Hiland Crow, was notorious for brutally flogging slaves.

In early 1788 the Potomac river froze over for five weeks, but even with nine inches of snow on the ground, Washington did not spare them from gruelling outdoor labour.

He sent the female slaves to dig up tree stumps from a frozen swamp.

During this Arctic snap, Washington ventured to ride out and inspect his farms, but noted in his diary that, "finding the cold disagreeable I returned".

When some of his slaves absconded during the Revolutionary War to find protection - humiliatingly, for him - with the enemy, Washington did not let up in his efforts to reclaim what he saw as his property.

Jefferson, as every American schoolchild knows, is the nation's third president, and a genius political theoretician who penned arguably the five most important words in modern history - "all men are created equal" - in the 1776 Declaration of Independence.

He also owned up to 140 slaves.

A bon vivant who lived in luxury at a palatial Virginia estate, Jefferson knew America's original sin was a "depravity", as he described it.

But his statements about black people are rarely taught in classrooms today.

Here are some Jefferson quotes that visitors will not find on his memorial, a Roman pantheon-style temple to liberty where the Sage of Monticello's graven image keeps vigil over the Tidal Basin in Washington DC.

To his friend, French social reformer the Duc de La Rochefoucauld-Liancourt, Jefferson confided that he envisaged eventual manumission to entail "exporting to a distance the whole black race".

The duke wrote: "He [Jefferson] bases his opinion on the certain danger… of seeing blood mixed without means of preventing it".

And yet Jefferson, historians say, fathered up to six children by one of his mixed-race slaves, Sally Hemings.

Link to Full Article:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-40978515

ALL AS BAD AS EACH OTHER

[Piling]

If in France we should remove all statues or streets/squares/metro stations named after colonialist, or antisemitic or sexist celebrities, there would be a lot of empty spot in our cities

[Anthea]

If in France we should remove all statues or streets/squares/metro stations named after colonialist, or antisemitic or sexist celebrities, there would be a lot of empty spot in our cities

Everything upsets someone somewhere

Statues of Christ offend Muslims and mosque's minaret towers offend Christians

My religious beliefs are older than both

[Anthea]

Aboriginals want Captain Cook statue which said he 'discovered Australia' REMOVED following violent protests in the US and calls to tear down Nelson's Column in London

Indigenous broadcaster Stan Grant took issue with an inscription on the statue

The statue of Captain Cook in Sydney's Hyde Park says he 'discovered Australia'

It follows unrest in the US which led to Confederate statues being pulled down

And yesterday a British broadcaster called for the removal of Nelson's Column

Aboriginals have called for the removal of a statue of Captain Cook which claims he 'discovered Australia'.

It follows violent protests in the US over a statue of Confederate leader Robert E Lee which many argued celebrates America's slave-owning past.

And only yesterday, a British broadcaster led calls to tear down Nelson's Column in London, arguing the 18th Century naval hero was a 'white supremacist'.

Indigenous Australian broadcaster Stan Grant said his country should follow the example set by the US and consider changing statues which leave a 'legacy of pain'.

He said the statue of Captain James cook which stands in Sydney's Hyde Park makes indigenous people feel 'invisible'.

Having led the 'First Fleet' of British ships to Australia in 1770, the statue of Captain Cook unveiled in 1879 is inscribed with: 'DISCOVERED THIS TERRITORY 1770.'

But in an opinion article written for the ABC, the respected Indigenous advocate told how the claims on the statue were a sore point for Indigenous people.

While saying he didn't want the statue pulled down, Mr Grant called it a reminder of 'the violent rupture of Aboriginal society' - one he claimed they are still enduring.

'This statue speaks to emptiness, it speaks to our invisibility,' he said.

'It says that nothing truly mattered, nothing truly counted until a white sailor first walked on these shores.'

Referring to the lack of acknowledgement about the way Australia had been taken in an instant from the Indigenous people, Mr Grant called it the 'great silence'.

In the past week, following racist rallies and riots, calls to tear down a statue of Confederate army leader Robert E Lee in Charlottesville have grown louder.


A British broadcaster led calls to tear down Nelson's Column in London, arguing the 18th Century naval hero was a 'white supremacist'

ust like Lee, who fought to keep slavery in the American Civil War, Captain Cook is a figure that brought pain to Australia, according to Mr Grant.

'Captain Cook's statue stands in the centre of our biggest city. There are Indigenous people who for good reason would prefer to see it removed,' he wrote.

Mr Grant added: 'Personally I accept that it remains; Cook is part of the story of this nation.'

His call to change the statue's inscription comes after a second Melbourne council voted in favour of not celebrating Australia Day in 2018 because its 'racist'.

The City of Darebin council, which governs several of Melbourne's northern suburbs, made the decision on Monday night - a week after the City of Yarra.

Workers in Charlottesville, Virginia, covered a statue of Confederate Robert E Lee in black to mourn a woman killed protesting a white nationalist rally earlier this month.

Heather Heyer was mowed down by a car during a counter-demonstration against the 'Unite the Right' event, believed to be the largest gathering of white nationalists in a decade.

Local staff used ropes and poles to cover the imposing statue of Lee on horseback as some onlookers cheered and applauded.

White nationalists and counter-protesters clashed violently on August 12, largely uninterrupted by police until the event was declared an unlawful assembly and the crowd was forced to disperse.

And yesterday, Sky News journalist Afua Hirsch said it was time to 'look at our own landscape' and tear down Nelson's Column following campaigns to remove similar statues in the US.

She said the monument in London's Trafalgar Square was a prime example of one which should be felled because Admiral Horatio Lord Nelson‎ defended slavery.‎ ‎

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... MOVED.html