Do Kurds living in/coming from NK want INDEPENDENCE

[Shirko]

Kurds that are actually living in NK and in Turkey have to decide on the utlimate goal and approach that they think is best for them. I want independence for all parts of Kurdistan, and its easy for me to say that. But in the end, it is the people on the ground that have to take the risk and make the sacrifice. Whatever the Kurdish leaders and people in NK decide, then we can support them. It seems that at the moment a decision has not been made yet and there really is no leadership or unity to speak of. And this is exactly what Turkey wants, but at the same time it can not control the events happening all around it. So it just buying time by giving a few small rights to the Kurds here and there, until the region settles down. Really what is needed the break the chains of occupation in NK? more development, education, growth and prosperity, OR a revolution peaceful or armed?

[Anthea]

Kurds that are actually living in NK and in Turkey have to decide on the utlimate goal and approach that they think is best for them. Everybody wants independence for all parts of Kurdistan, and its easy for most of us to say that. But in the end, it is the people on the ground that have to take the risk and make the sacrifice. Whatever the Kurdish leaders and people in NK decide, then we can support them. Seems to me, that at the moment, a decision has not been made yet and there really is no leadership to speak of.

Very true. It is up to the Kurds living inside the Turkey borders to make INFORMED DECISIONS. Little problem I foresee, the young Kurds have the knowledge and the information whereas the old Kurds make the decisions

I think that most of us, if we do not actually come from NK ourselves have contact with people who do come from NK, and/or people who are currently in NK, and people who have joined the PKK. I openly admit to have known people who have been, and probably still are (if they are still alive) PKK freedom fighters.

So when I say that every Kurd I have ever known wants a free independent Kurdistan, I am including all those brave freedom fighters I have had the pleasure of knowing. They gave up families, friends, the chance of having children of their own or a career, because they were prepared to fight and die for a FREE KURDISTAN. And I would be doing them a great disservice if I betrayed their trust in me and ever suggested that Kurds settle for anything less than freedom.

Another reason that now is the right time for Kurds in NK to push theirs demands for freedom is the upheaval and disruption that may well take place due to the Turkish governments constitutional changes. I do NOT believe that it was a wise decision on the part of erDOGan to make such far reaching changes, especially those such as doing away with the secular state and becoming a more Islamic state, without holding a referendum or waiting for an election and including it as part of erDOGan's manifesto.

Many people will not be happy with what they will perceive to be the growth of Islam in a region fraught with problems due to Islamic fundamentalists. Nor will Kamelists be pleased. We know that erDOGan arrested many Kamelist military leaders in an attempt to tighten government control over the military, but I am not sure exactly how strong that control will be because the military probably still follow the Kamelist ideology.

[Shirko]

Anthea, sorry but I did some editing a.

[Anthea]

Anthea, sorry but I did some editing a.

Exactly. Turkey is frightened because Kurds everywhere else are becoming stronger and more independent

Turkey treats Kurds as though they were dogs and it is throwing Kurds a few rights to try and control them. They think that Kurds are too stupid to see what is happening. The way Turkey is taking all the wealth from Kurdish land it is rather like someone stealing a pound from someone else and giving them a penny back

[Shirko]

Anthea, I agree with some of what you said. But I do not agree with your anti-Islamic comments. That really has nothing to due with the Kurdish struggle. You said its a region filled with problems due to Islamic fundamentalism. Its really a region filled with problems due to colonialism and the West playing one group against the other to try and control the rescources and the people, Islamic fundamentalism is just a result of that. And in Kurdistan, that will never be a problem, because Kurds know more than anyone else about religion and extremists from ANY religion will never have a chance there.

[Natsidruk]

Religion should'nt have anything to do in a goverment. It's a private thing. That's what I like about KRG and kurds, we are more secular than most other peoples in the middle east (arabs, persians, turks etc). And we should keep it that way. I have nothing against religions or particularly Islam. Im a muslim myself.

[Anthea]

Anthea, I agree with some of what you said. But I do not agree with your anti-Islamic comments. That really has nothing to due with the Kurdish struggle. You said its a region filled with problems due to Islamic fundamentalism. Its really a region filled with problems due to colonialism and the West playing one group against the other to try and control the rescources and the people, Islamic fundamentalism is just a result of that. And in Kurdistan, that will never be a problem, because Kurds know more than anyone else about religion and extremists from ANY religion will never have a chance there.

Another reason that now is the right time for Kurds in NK to push theirs demands for freedom is the upheaval and disruption that may well take place due to the Turkish governments constitutional changes. I do NOT believe that it was a wise decision on the part of erDOGan to make such far reaching changes, especially those such as doing away with the secular state and becoming a more Islamic state, without holding a referendum or waiting for an election and including it as part of erDOGan's manifesto.

Many people will not be happy with what they will perceive to be the growth of Islam in a region fraught with problems due to Islamic fundamentalists. Nor will Kamelists be pleased. We know that erDOGan arrested many Kamelist military leaders in an attempt to tighten government control over the military, but I am not sure exactly how strong that control will be because the military probably still follow the Kamelist ideology.

HZKurdi, my comments were NOT meant to be anti-Islamic. They are more a statement of FACT. Given the rise in Islamic fundamentalism in Syria, we are all aware of many different Islamic groups (many of them not even Syrian) fighting the government and the Kurds and the fact that Turkey is doing away with its secular constitution making way for a more Islamic country, people are becoming worried.

[RawandKurdistani]

BDP are up against a Nato country with the support of the entire Western world. What do you expect them to do? Simply talking about Kurdish independence in Turkey will get all of the BDP politicians behind bars.

Simple answer YES

1) The rest of the world, including NATO, could not allow Turkey to imprison an entire political party

2) The PKK fighters do not just talk about independence they fight for independence and they do not get put behind bars they get KILLED fighting for independence

Have you ever taken a look at Kurdish history? You should know, that the world doesn't give f*ck. It's a proven fact, that even in the 21'th century, we are still ignored, while 3 million Palestinians get the worlds attention.

[Anthea]

Have you ever taken a look at Kurdish history? You should know, that the world doesn't give f*ck. It's a proven fact, that even in the 21'th century, we are still ignored, while 3 million Palestinians get the worlds attention.

TRUE SADLY TRUE. When all those bodies were found in the river at Aleppo last week, NOBODY mentioned that they were Kurdish. Many of them were identified as being from Aleppo so they MUST have been Kurdish.

There were Syrians living to the North of Aleppo, but they were the people placed there by the Syrian government in order to separate the Kurds inside Syria from the Kurds inside Turkey. Those Syrians are all safely inside Turkey.

To be honest I do NOT know what to do. I only know that doing nothing is NOT an option.

[Fire]

Well, every Kurd must know. If we won't get indepence and live together with our Subhuman Enemies in one Country (Turkey) we will always be second and third class People and will live like foreigners. To describe it shortly. Like today , maybe even worse. But even if we would be equal to the Subhumans, I don't want to live together with People who I hate like poison.

[Anthea]

Well, every Kurd must know. If we won't get indepence and live together with our Subhuman Enemies in one Country (Turkey) we will always be second and third class People and will live like foreigners. To describe it shortly. Like today , maybe even worse. But even if we would be equal to the Subhumans, I don't want to live together with People who I hate like poison.

VERY TRUE

We must not only remember all the terrible things that Turkey has done to Kurdish people, we MUST remember how Turks themselves treat Kurds.

YES WE KNOW THAT THERE ARE SOME SUCCESSFUL KURDISH BUSINESSMEN Thought that I would mention it before someone else does

Turkish business do NOT want to employ Kurds. And most Kurds can only find work in the lowest paid jobs

So even if the Turkish government became Kurd loving saints overnight Kurds will still be treated like SUBHUMANS by the Turkish population as a whole. And, for the most part, live in the worst most run-down areas of places such as Istanbul.

[Anthea]

In light of recent events, namely the so-called "Peace Talks", that I personally feel should be renamed "Unconditional Surrender Talks", which will removed any and all chance of Kurds in Turkey ever having any form of independence and condemning coming generations of Kurds to being no more than third rate citizens in part a country that should be theirs by right, I must ask this question once more

Every Kurd who I have ever met and or spoken to, have always told me about their country and how much they want Kurdistan to be free. I often wonder exactly who the BDP actually represent

Do Kurds living in/coming from NK want INDEPENDENCE ? ? ?

[Anthea]

In the few months since I first asked this question, several changes have taken place in Turkey.

Sadly none of the changes have actually benefited the Kurds living there

The BDP would try to convince Kurds that they would be better off giving up any claim to a Kurdish homeland or any self-rule

There has been a lot of talk about what might or might not take place but actions speak louder than words

What actions have actually taken place ?

Ocalan's lawyers have been banned from visiting him for almost 2 years

Karayilan's request that he sends PKK representatives to visit Ocalan have been ignored

Ocalan has been made to persuade the PKK to leave Turkey WHY ?

A cease-fire is good BUT there is NO NEED for the PKK to leave Turkey

In other countries, where there is an internal conflict, when one side surrenders (which is what Ocalan has done) the fighters are NOT banished to another country

Perhaps the evil Turkish regime thinks that by sending the PKK to South Kurdistan they will de-stabilise the region (whatever erDOGan says I am positive that he is not entirely happy with the fact that he has such a powerful Kurdish (soon to be) nation so close

The fact that South Kurdistan becomes stronger month by month has the undeniable affect of re-energising the Kurdish dream of Independence (the very reason erDOGan has persuaded the PKK to leave and Ocalan to deny the Kurds any such independence or self-rule

Ocalan has been made to persuade Kurds to give up all hope of and Independent North Kurdistan

Ocalan has been made to convince Kurds to work with Turks in brotherly love that denies future generations of Kurds any chance of Independence

Many Kurds remain in prison for supporting the PKK, some with nothing more than the written word, or for just referring to Ocalan as Mr Ocalan

Turkey is increasing its' military bases in the Kurdish region

Neither the PKK nor the BDP has ever held a referendum to ask the Kurds what they want

[Piling]

Turkish army claims that a military basis on the 'Iraqi' border has been attacked. So the cease fire might be cancelled, and the process peace ?

[Anthea]

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Are Kurds dying of APATHY